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Let your next career move come to you.

People giving a genuine apology

On the face of it, this boxer has genuinely apologised for racially abusing someone.

It seems rare these days for people to publicly and genuinely apologise, rather than deny or obfuscate.

Does ROF think there are some transgressions (in terms of saying things rather than physical assaults etc...) where an apology doesn't resolve things?

Or should everyone be able to move on without further judgment with a fullsome and heartfelt apology?

No one else gets to decide if someone "should" forgive 

forgiveness is often considered to be a prerequisite to healing but I don't accept that. There are plenty of people and things I am entirely at peace with, but I haven't forgiven and never will 

 

genuine ?? at rof’s resident entirely unapologetic rightards hectoring and pontificating about how to apologise

as if u have ever apologised properly u massive hypocrites 

I believe I'm generally quite civil.

Think the only person I've never forgiven is the only person who did something horrible to me and never apologised and in fact just sat back and watched others apologise for the same thing without even acknowledging he'd been involved.

This afternoon I need to persuade someone to give a real apology.  I am sure he will refuse and cost his organisation a huge amount. It may even cost him his position.

But people are stubborn and stupid. 

I would say nobody nowadays apologies unreservedly or assumes sole responsibility for acts. Perhaps this is down to the decline in Christianity meaning that you don't worry that you'll be judged for your spineless weasel-like conduct. 

I have genuinely apologised to you Serge for calling you bald and intimating that you and your sister share the family chromosome.  Did you accept it gracefully?  Did you bollox.

People seem to have forgiven Tyson Fury for all the w**k he's said re women and homosexuals.  Not so much that aussie rugby player (was it Israel folau, I think it was).

a properly sincere apology, owning and accepting ones own mistakes should be met with forgiveness, it would provide you closure and the transgressor the hope to become a better person, everybody is wrong about something and makes mistakes, if we can forgive others of theirs we will be more accepting of our own

Thanks Rhialto, I've held my hands up and I hope we can draw a line under this and move on.

But not before acknowledging the credit I deserve for apologising.

Not many people could have done what I've just done.

Simply saying sorry is fine for something like accidentally bumping into someone in the street.

But a serious apology contains three elements:

1). a full explanation that you appreciate that the fault is yours, that you recognise the pain that you have caused other(s), and have heartfelt regret

2). correction for the current offence in a way to 'make good' as closely as possible, plus  compensation

3). commitment to the steps that you will take in future to prevent (/reduce the likelihood) repetition of the offence, including how your success will be monitored and the sanctions that will be imposed if you fail.

I use this structure when making complaints to public sector bodies and companies. After being told explicitly what I want they are generally pretty good on 1) and 2).  They are utterly miserable on point 3), from which I draw the conclusion that they are not sincere ...

Lets take the most common form of apology.

 

"Sorry, what did you say,"  or words to that affect.

 

It is usually genuine.  You really did wish to hear them.  No.2 is presumably not applicable.  No. 3 feels like overkill 

Why are you saying sorry?

Because you weren't giving them full attention?

Because you are inconveniencing them, perhaps due to circumstances outside either of your control?

No 2. You can commit to listen especially carefully as they repeat what you missed

No 3. Probably is overkill.  But if you didn't hear them because you were busy concentrating on roffing [quite likely :) in the circumstances], you could commit in future never to look at a screen while they are talking to you, and agree that if you do they can confiscate  your phone for an hour.

I agree with the elf

So step 1 - Sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings. I think I lashed out because I feel innately superior to all of you - not necessarily saying I'm right but that's how I feel - I'll try to work on this but I don't know how or where to start.

Elfi I should point out that I have a slight issue here in that I do feel that a great many posters in this place are genuine shit stains with few if any redeeming qualities - please advise.

Right on to step 2 - I think I covered that above

Step 3 - if I do it again I promise to say sorry again and maybe think about giving some money to charity

Again

I'm sorry

Apologies cost nothing.  I agree with Arnold Rothstein. Nothing says ' I'm sorry' like money. 

Pay for the dry cleaning, get a gift voucher for the shop for the broken vase, if you were racist go and do voluntary work with people of that race, if they'll take you.

The problem is generally because sorry has more than one meaning.  One can be sorry that something happened to someone, despite having nothing to do with it (I'm sorry your girlfriend hit you on the head with a lamp); sorry for the harm caused by your actions without being sorry for the actions (I'm sorry I hurt you with a lamp but you deserved it for cheating) but also sorry meaning you take personal responsibility for an act and are sorry you did it (I'm sorry I overreacted and lost control and hit you with a lamp, it was completely unjustified regardless of what you may or may not have done).

I guess only the last one is what we call a full 'apology', but the others are also perfectly fine ways of conveying different levels of regret.  It when a**holes pretend a second level sorry (sorry if/that you were offended) is actually a third level full apology.  Hate those people, hate them.

The first category is fine because it's regret about someone else's actions.

The second category is the only real apology.  The third category is worse than no apology and I agree - it acknowledges that the person should apologise, but isn't doing so fully and likely wants the benefits associated with a real apology.

 

it takes grace to admit one's failings and lapses, and it takes an equal amount of grace, when an apology is offered, to forgive in recognition that every single one of us falters

it's a bit of a prisoner's dilemma in that a lack of grace from one party results in a mutual hardening of the heart, the aggrieved and transgressor alike

"Sorry for any" is the w**ker's opening gambit. I am sorry you are a snowflake is the gist of it and companies love it, along with "deep regret". 

What I meant about religion is not them being sorry for acts they believe are required/justified, but that the whole premise of confession is that you completely own up to the "bad things", and that's the only way you can be truly forgiven in the eyes of God. I went to a ridiculous sermon where the vicar, for reasons known only to him, went on about adultery equating to failing to eat your veg or something similar, throwing in some stuff about provacatively dressed women inviting the sin for good measure (some sort of inchoate religious offence I suppose) i.e. all sins are equal in the eyes of God and you must repent for them. 

Now there is final judgment to keep you on your apologising toes, people do what makes them feel the least culpable e.g. I am sorry this upsets you (your fault), I am sorry this happened but if that butterfly hadn't flapped its wings it wouldn't have come to this (someone else's fault). I actually think apologising wholeheartedly now isn't even worth it as there is no forgiveness on the other side of the coin (the other imperative that exists among Christians). 

You can see the opposite in Japanese culture, where they think an apology cures everything - sorry we cut corners in this nuclear reactor, sorry we doled out the massive bribes, sorry we were part of a massive cartel. Let's bow and scrape and it's all cool. 

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