Very calm though. Imagine that on the tube, someone would be losing their shit.

I do feel for the people and there families on a human level but I have very little general sympathy - 

A study published in the Frontiers journal compared greenhouse gas emissions reported by 167 cities in 53 countries and found that 23 Chinese cities — among them Shanghai, Beijing and Handan — along with Moscow and Tokyo accounted for 52 per cent of total emissions. 

I believe the classicist have a word for this... hubris

It’s not like we are saints. We buy the goods they produce!

NGL I do have a buy British first policy lol 

They are still well ahead of us per capita, Langbar, and that's a pretty shit attitude. The average Chinese citizen has less control over their carbon footprint than you do.

Orwell - that is good shout and I do stand down and stand corrected - my attitude is shitty but should not be 

But I don't understand why British workers should lose jobs, livelyhoods and communities in the dash for green energy and a carbon neutral economy when the majority of the world do not seem to care.   

They will care so we can either get busy becoming world leaders in green tech or carry on being overgrown toddlers whining about how unfair it is that other countries are not doing what we think they should.

1. China is leading the drive on sustainability policy. 

2. There are plenty of other jurisdictions that care more than the UK.

3. This shit is guaranteed not to improve if peoe keep doing the "But China" excuse not to take a y action.

4. We have legally implemented the Paris Agreement commitments. This isn't up for debate.

5. British workers will absolutely lose their livelihoods if we do nothing.

Royal - I get what you saying and I do agree. But it is a little The White Mans Burden for me. We lead the way as a paternal figure to show the rest of the world? - demonstrating how enlightened we are?

 I don't understand why British workers should lose jobs, livelyhoods and communities in the dash for green energy and a carbon neutral economy when the majority of the world do not seem to care.

Poor understanding of economics. 

It’s the same as globalisation based on a simplistic application of the theory of comparative advantage: actually all trade is good ONLY if the cost of externalities are appropriately allocated

 I don't understand why British workers should lose jobs, livelyhoods and communities in the dash for green energy and a carbon neutral economy when the majority of the world do not seem to care.

Poor understanding of economics. 

It’s the same as globalisation based on a simplistic application of the theory of comparative advantage: actually all trade is good ONLY if the cost of externalities are appropriately allocated

Those five pointers from Orwell. 

God some people here...

I mean orwell's points are spot on. 

Quite the opposite langbar. The opportunity to throw off our paternalist past and become a more nimble, forward thinking country is what I'm suggesting. We are still a relatively rich country for now and I would rather focus our remaining muscle towards where we need to be in 5 to 10 years than trying to show we can mix it with China and the US. 

The alternative is complete obscurity.

Elfffi - yes Keynes would turn in his grave - but we are in a new age - the government via the OR took over British Steel - every high polluting capital intensive industry is on the table and think a lot of the basic fundamental economic rules from the last century no longer apply. 

Royal - We can mix it a little with the US and China - for the 'soft power' that is our niche and where the investment should go - bbc world service and the creative industries.  

Shall we get back to the horror of being in a Tube carriage watching the contents of the tunnel pouring through the doors into the carriage?

Sails not sure what is more repressive the regime or the tube carriage... 

They were calm sails. Chinese stiff upper lip.

Orwell20 Jul 21 20:59

1. China is leading the drive on sustainability policy. 

What about those hundreds of new coal fired power stations?

What about their going from 10% of world emissions to 30% since 2000?

I know it is cool to idolise anyone who is anti western, but facts are facts.

I would not be calm.

Feel free to join the conversation when you grasp the basic concepts under discussion KG 

Thought you like water sails?

I could be wrong but I think he likes water with sails. Not bobbing about. 

Does any one else chuckle that kg is arguing with Orwell. Eric Blair chose the first name George because of King George V and took the last name the river Orwell in Suffolk. The most English of all names. 

It has been somewhat inclement lately it’s true

Langbar, does the teesside reference in your name indicate that you’re Pinko in disguise?

I like being on water but never been a fan of being under it especially in a manner where you can’t get out of it at your choosing.

I like being on water but never been a fan of being under it especially in a manner where you can’t get out of it at your choosing.
 

Wise words.

I also dislike drowning or drowning-adjacent situations.

I don't think anyone likes drowning apart from my mate's weird ex who liked having her head held under water in the bath during sechs.

Allowing China in the WTO and expecting it would all be sweetness and light as they fell into line was a big mistake.  

And also..holy crap at those people in the subway. 

how are they all so calm?????

I mean with mask wearing like that there must be covid EVerywhere

Sails, did your mate ever give his ex the flush treatment a la Rocco on Bobbi Starr?