MOSCOW, March 22 (Reuters) - As many as five gunmen dressed in camouflage clothing opened fire with automatic weapons at people in the Crocus City Hall music venue near Moscow, leaving an unknown number of people dead and injured, video footage from the scene showed.
It was not immediately clear how many people had been injured and who the gunmen were, but Russian news agencies said 50 ambulance crews had been sent to the scene.
Ukraine wouldn’t have done this. My bet is it’s a Reichstag fire.
The thing about the Reichstag fire is that it's highly unclear that it was a false flag attack. The majority of historians lean towards the view that while exploited by the Nazis, they had no involvement in planning it or even being aware of the plans and letting them happen.
It's fascinating to witness how jingoism drives people to remove their usual critical faculties. Indeed, the same people as would likely describe those making similar sorts of "inside job" claims about 9/11 or 7/7 as loons .
Two weeks ago, the US issued a warning to its citizens in Russia that it was "monitoring reports that extremists have imminent plans to target large gatherings in Moscow, to include concerts”. Sounds like the US intelligence was pretty on point. It would be interesting to know who those "extremists" might be - clearly the US has some sort of idea. But it's not a great data point in terms of supporting the idea that the Putin / the Russian ruling regime is behind this.
Why did the gunmen wear camouflage? They were in a concert hall in a large urban area, not a jungle and were armed to the teeth. They were likely to stand out a bit regardless.
Trouble with Russia is there are so many possible groups to choose from. Perhaps Russian army pissed at the number of their mates who’ve been sacrificed to save armoured vehicles for the summer?
ISIS have claimed it, but actually it was cooked up by Obama and Sunak when they had their secret meeting the other day at no.10. Obama created ISIS as his own personal terror group and he still controls them even though Putin wiped them out years ago. Obama is actually still POTUS and controls Biden through Telekinesis and black magic Voodoo.
Look it up sheeple. The evidence is all there. MAGA.
Why did the gunmen wear camouflage? They were in a concert hall in a large urban area, not a jungle and were armed to the teeth. They were likely to stand out a bit regardless.
One of two likely reasons. If they were in similar uniforms to the local security services its to help them move to the area and escape by posing as security services, who routinely carry weapons so that them being armed would not cause alarm.
If they were in non-security services uniform its likely to help them identify each other and not shoot each other. This is one of the purposes of uniforms in all armies.
Third possibility but seems unlikely is they are trying to give themselves an argument if captured that they are soldiers and thus prisoners of war, one of the Geneva Convention requirements being that soldiers must fight in uniform. IS I think do like to claim they are a proper nation and their terrorists are actually genuine soldiers.
there was credible intel shared by the US with Russia warning of IS planning an attack on russian soil
very much their MO
it seems they’ve caught them. Russia has the death penalty yes? Assuming they did actually do this then I look forward to these guys dying like dogs, they shot little children fgs and all over their fvcking vague and weird and morally invalid agenda
It's fascinating to witness how jingoism drives people to remove their usual critical faculties. Indeed, the same people as would likely describe those making similar sorts of "inside job" claims about 9/11 or 7/7 as loons .
Moscow is quite heavily policed by paramilitary police
Russia's enemies have very little to gain from this
the chances of false flags in Russia organised by the Kremlin are vastly higher than in most states
now that said, it seems ISIS (didn't realise they were still a thing) are claiming responsibility, I'm deeply suspicious of anything Russian and their obsession with performative bullshittery but this seems to be the accepted explanation.
Putin is saying Ukraine is linked to the attack, unsurprisingly. Maybe the russian media didn't openly report the US warning, although Putin can say anything to furnish his own agenda.
Allegedly part of the reason for such loss of life was that the emergency exit doors were pretty much all locked for ‘security’ reasons. If true, then in the West the persons i/c would have lost their jobs and perhaps faced lawsuits for this: in Russia their plausible defence would probably be that they would have lost their jobs if those doors hadn’t been locked.
There is credible evidence from Russians themselves (e.g. Alexander Litvienko) that some of the pre-Chechen war atrocities were designed to boost Putin or force his hand. Nothing to do with jingoism.
It’s always amazing how quickly dictators in particular seem able to catch suspects despite being caught with their pants down in the first place. One might be slightly sceptical if one was of that mind…
I guess, if you're Isis and you have been being bombed by Russia for 10 years in Syria and you see how weak the Russian armed forces are and Prigozhin take a run at Moscow and Ukraine blasting fcuk out of refineries and airfields and whatnot with drones you might take the view that actually Russia is a soft target and have a go - which seems to have worked
I wonder if there will be more and I wonder how this will play with the hard right in Russia versus the conservative Muslim populations in the south/centre of the country
0
3
MOSCOW, March 22 (Reuters) - As many as five gunmen dressed in camouflage clothing opened fire with automatic weapons at people in the Crocus City Hall music venue near Moscow, leaving an unknown number of people dead and injured, video footage from the scene showed.
It was not immediately clear how many people had been injured and who the gunmen were, but Russian news agencies said 50 ambulance crews had been sent to the scene.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/shooting-blast-reported-concert-ha…
1
4
Just prep for the next Sophie Ellis-Bextor concert after she stormed Bataclan.
0
3
Won’t be Ukraine but won’t stop Putin using it to accuse the country and bolster his arguments for the ‘war’.
0
3
I wouldn't put it past Putin to have orchestrated this to blame Ukraine.
0
3
Putin will absolutely blame Ukraine and probably send a few dozen hypersonic missiles at Kyiv later.
0
4
More likely orchestrated by some hard right russians to force Putin's hand. Like those hostage taking before the war in Chechnya.
0
3
Why were they wearing camo?
0
3
Islamic terrorists?
0
4
Ukraine wouldn’t have done this. My bet is it’s a Reichstag fire.
3
3
The thing about the Reichstag fire is that it's highly unclear that it was a false flag attack. The majority of historians lean towards the view that while exploited by the Nazis, they had no involvement in planning it or even being aware of the plans and letting them happen.
0
9
‘The majority of historians’. Christ you’re thick
0
2
Barely a week after the "election" with Putin looking for a reason to declare an unpopular wave of mobilisation?
A group of men with machine guns left to wander moscow?
Feels a bit orchestrated by the kremlin
4
2
It's fascinating to witness how jingoism drives people to remove their usual critical faculties. Indeed, the same people as would likely describe those making similar sorts of "inside job" claims about 9/11 or 7/7 as loons .
Two weeks ago, the US issued a warning to its citizens in Russia that it was "monitoring reports that extremists have imminent plans to target large gatherings in Moscow, to include concerts”. Sounds like the US intelligence was pretty on point. It would be interesting to know who those "extremists" might be - clearly the US has some sort of idea. But it's not a great data point in terms of supporting the idea that the Putin / the Russian ruling regime is behind this.
0
2
Why did the gunmen wear camouflage? They were in a concert hall in a large urban area, not a jungle and were armed to the teeth. They were likely to stand out a bit regardless.
0
2
Could help them to get into the mindset?
0
2
Trouble with Russia is there are so many possible groups to choose from. Perhaps Russian army pissed at the number of their mates who’ve been sacrificed to save armoured vehicles for the summer?
0
2
havent islamic state said it was them?
1
2
ISIS have claimed it, but actually it was cooked up by Obama and Sunak when they had their secret meeting the other day at no.10. Obama created ISIS as his own personal terror group and he still controls them even though Putin wiped them out years ago. Obama is actually still POTUS and controls Biden through Telekinesis and black magic Voodoo.
Look it up sheeple. The evidence is all there. MAGA.
1
2
Wow RR, I feel like my eyes have been opened. It’s all so obvious.
How do Harry and Megan fit in?
1
2
I don't know exactly, but apparently Meghan has some Oungan blood and could be giving cancer to her enemies with her mind.
0
2
One of two likely reasons. If they were in similar uniforms to the local security services its to help them move to the area and escape by posing as security services, who routinely carry weapons so that them being armed would not cause alarm.
If they were in non-security services uniform its likely to help them identify each other and not shoot each other. This is one of the purposes of uniforms in all armies.
Third possibility but seems unlikely is they are trying to give themselves an argument if captured that they are soldiers and thus prisoners of war, one of the Geneva Convention requirements being that soldiers must fight in uniform. IS I think do like to claim they are a proper nation and their terrorists are actually genuine soldiers.
0
2
doesn’t look false flag to me
there was credible intel shared by the US with Russia warning of IS planning an attack on russian soil
very much their MO
it seems they’ve caught them. Russia has the death penalty yes? Assuming they did actually do this then I look forward to these guys dying like dogs, they shot little children fgs and all over their fvcking vague and weird and morally invalid agenda
0
3
Would this meaningfully weaken Putin, who scoffed at the warning?
1
2
No.
But they might fall out of a window or have some kind of an incident at a remote Siberian penal colony
0
2
Rob Cannon22 Mar 24 21:00
It's fascinating to witness how jingoism drives people to remove their usual critical faculties. Indeed, the same people as would likely describe those making similar sorts of "inside job" claims about 9/11 or 7/7 as loons .
____________________________________________________________________________
there's no comparison with 9/11
Putin has form on this
Moscow is quite heavily policed by paramilitary police
Russia's enemies have very little to gain from this
the chances of false flags in Russia organised by the Kremlin are vastly higher than in most states
now that said, it seems ISIS (didn't realise they were still a thing) are claiming responsibility, I'm deeply suspicious of anything Russian and their obsession with performative bullshittery but this seems to be the accepted explanation.
0
2
Putin is saying Ukraine is linked to the attack, unsurprisingly. Maybe the russian media didn't openly report the US warning, although Putin can say anything to furnish his own agenda.
0
2
Allegedly part of the reason for such loss of life was that the emergency exit doors were pretty much all locked for ‘security’ reasons. If true, then in the West the persons i/c would have lost their jobs and perhaps faced lawsuits for this: in Russia their plausible defence would probably be that they would have lost their jobs if those doors hadn’t been locked.
0
2
There is credible evidence from Russians themselves (e.g. Alexander Litvienko) that some of the pre-Chechen war atrocities were designed to boost Putin or force his hand. Nothing to do with jingoism.
0
2
*litvinenko
0
2
They've caught all 4 attackers. You'd think the attackers would just turn the guns on themselves rather then get caught?
0
3
There’s a video of one of them being made to eat his ear, I didn’t watch that one.
0
2
It’s always amazing how quickly dictators in particular seem able to catch suspects despite being caught with their pants down in the first place. One might be slightly sceptical if one was of that mind…
0
1
There’s a vid supposedly made by a shooter and he’s clearly isis, allegedly.
0
1
I guess, if you're Isis and you have been being bombed by Russia for 10 years in Syria and you see how weak the Russian armed forces are and Prigozhin take a run at Moscow and Ukraine blasting fcuk out of refineries and airfields and whatnot with drones you might take the view that actually Russia is a soft target and have a go - which seems to have worked
I wonder if there will be more and I wonder how this will play with the hard right in Russia versus the conservative Muslim populations in the south/centre of the country
Join the discussion